I have been a member here for a while. I have learned so many things about Quakers and other parrots. The one thing I have put off learning is that there are far too many of these wonderful birds being rehomed, time after time. I can no longer say it is okay to do so. I cannot continue to congratulate people for breeding and rehoming. I realize life throws curves and sometimes we cannot take on the battles we are dealt with. I have been taught here... that before you even think about getting a bird, remember you are going to have that bird for a long, long, long, time. I did everything in my power to keep my sweet bird. Sure, I had hard times. Really hard times. I realize a relationship may be on the line or money is tight but life does go on rich or poor, together or alone. To breed for money is another of my pet peeves. I have a great aversion toward it. The ASPCA does not recognize birds as pets, I do. They are called caged birds, these pets. They deserve a standard of life just as any of us do. I will not continue to contribute to breeding and rehoming. I have seen a CAG troubled and alone because he missed his owner. He was passed off to the owners son because owner thought he didn't have the time or health for bird anymore. I reunited them. If the owner gets ill , that CAG will be there to take care of him until someone arrives. CAG was soooo homesick and out of place when I met him. He finally went home. Some of you might think I am a bleeding heart. I think my heart is in the right place.

While I understand your frustration I have to say that I do not agree with all that you have said.

I would much rather see a bird rehomed than live in sorrow, misery and inadequacy. And, let us be honest here, while we love our pets, that is what they are...pets. I would easily rehome ALL my animals if it meant more food on the table for my children.

Yes, I brought my animals into my home, but life has a way of throwing curve balls at you. Most pet owners bring a bird home with the intention of keeping it for life...but unfortunately life does get in the way and that can't always happen. I see nothing wrong with rehoming a bird IF you feel that it is the best decision for you and your bird. If a bird is lacking in some form, whether it be attention, food, out of cage time, or whatever, then the owner has the right to find a place where that bird will have a full filling life.

Now, I am not saying that to rehome a bird because the newness has worn off, or you are bored, or just don't want the bird anymore, is okay.....BUT, I would rather see that bird go to a decent home then to stay where it is no longer wanted.

As for breeding...

Well, I am a breeder and I can tell you that I don't do it for the money. It costs me 5 times as much to breed as it does to sell the chicks. I do it because I love it. I make sure to find good homes for the babies and I keep them until they do find good homes. If I can't find a good home, then the baby doesn't leave this house. I am not a mass breeder, I only do one clutch at a time. Am I over populating the system? I don't think so because birds are not in abundant here (and I know this from volunteering at the SPCA). I've had numerous phone calls for people looking for birds and I have recommended avian rescue centres (none locally because there are none) for that person to find the bird they are looking for.

In any event, that is a bit more than two cents But I did have to say how I felt. And again, I do understand your frustrations, but it is frustrating when all breeders get lumped together as well as lumping together all people who rehome their birds. Each and every situation is different and I'm a firm believer in it is not my job to judge any one because I truly do not know what they are going through.

I know this is a really touchy subject and especially to people that absolutely LOVE birds, like myself. I could never be a breeder......I would never want to sell any of the birds..... ......as far as the rehoming, well that kind of hits a very "raw" nerve for me BUT it is also a very "Catch-22" situation. When I got Kiwi 7 yrs ago there was NO research done on quakers before we brought him home. He was bought to fill up some time in my life and give me some responsibility after the loss of my son. That was 7 years ago and now 2 birds later.........and lots of turmoil in my life financially. Would I re-home my birds????? It would absolutely devastate me to have to do so but I would only do it as a last resort and that would be feeding me over my birds. If I can't eat, how could I feed and take care of my birds? Or if I was in a situation where I could no longer take care of them.......

I have to agree with Carrie...re-homing sometimes is in the best intrest of the bird.I would like to think that my birds will be here to watch me grow old..or rather grow old with me.And in the case of my macaws...be handed down to my son after I am gone. BUT I have no clue what the future holds for me....
The couple that did raise my macaws and then re-homed them to me...did the best they could for them.It was hard for them to let them go..I know I was there to see the tears flow as we loaded them and their cage into the truck.BUT the birds had been lacking badly in out of cage time and attention.Wold it have been better for them to stay with those that raised them...even though the spent weeks at a time locked in their cage? Or was the better choice to re-home them to someone who could give them more time and attention?

As far as breeding goes? Some breeders just don't care about the birds...I agree that is wrong..but not much can be done. We discussed the option of breeding my macaw pair...and I came to the conclusion that I did not want to bring more of these birds into the world.They live 80 + years..I did not want to be responsible for that.
Sometimes for a person who wants to share their life with a parrot a rescue or re-home is a bad choice..I can tell you from experience that re-homes can be tricky at first..I many times felt like I got in way over my head with mine.many many bites..lots of lost blood and even stitches in on one occasion. Lots of people would not be able to deal with that...therefor a breeder is the best thing for them.

i guess all I can say is guilty...and I disagree with you entirely. I'm not going to sit here and defend my positioning...I'm afraid I would hurt too many people's feelings.

Yea I have to say I disagree as well. I much rather give my bird to a loving home if I had to. If I fell ill..or if I couldn't give him the life he deserves. I wouldn't want to see him suffer because I couldn't be the best parront I could be. Yes people need to consider what they are getting into when they buy any animal. Especially birds because of their attention needs and their long life. You can't help what life sometimes throws at you. I'm about to accept a bird from someone who feels that they just can't give him the attention he needs. They want to see him go to a good home where he will be spoiled and loved. There's nothing wrong with that.
Now I know there are breeders who arent good. Who don't care about their birds and are only looking to make a profit. I don't believe you will find any on this board. But if there weren't breeders..where would you get a bird? And if you take the time to care and hand raise these babies you should certainly be compensated. I hate that the prices are so high for birds but I am thankful because that keeps some irresponsible people from purchasing them on a whim. If the breeder is crappy and doesn't care about their birds then yes I see your point. But I don't see your point about rehoming.

I think we all need to remember, until you've walked a mile in someone else's shoes its best not to pass judgement on anyone's particular situation.

I have a lot of respect for people who have made the decision to rehome birds before there was a definite problem...

In this game of life there are many things that can happen that can cause the floor to fall out from under us and cause circumstances to change. I feel when that happens to people and they realize that they can no longer take care of an animal to the level they feel is appropriate then it is best to rehome them. I would much rather see a pet bird or any other type be rehomed while it is healthy and in good condition, rather than limp along and only give it bare minimum care.

Lets also remember that there is a difference in rescue with rehome in mind than just purchasing and then not knowing what you were getting into and not being able to handle it. And then rehoming it. But I still feel that's far better than to make the bird or whatever pet it might be live the rest of its life in a home where it's abused and neglected.

Remember also as I just mentioned...there is a BIG difference when someone rescues a problem bird, rehabilitates it and then rehomes it The bird was actually taken on, to rehabilitate it so it was capable of being rehomed. Many people have done that and done it successfully as several of our members right here on this board have done.

While I don't agree with the type that just get a bird willie nillie without doing the research and then end up in over their heads or just grow tired of the burden of day to day care.

Should we stop breeding birds entirely? All birds? If we did, many of us wouldn't have our Quakers much less a lot of other birds.

I understand the point that was trying to be made I think... in that should we be continuing to breed species that we know will live 80 + years? When a lot of those exact birds will end up in Sanctuaries and be rehomed etc etc.

That's why this forum is in place...its to Educate people of specific needs and what not of not just Quakers but for other species.

So...I guess my question and rebuttle to this thread is this. Should I just have said...NO...I can't take this 20 year old Blue and Gold Macaw or this 16 year old Umbrella cockatoo because I'm 50+ years old and I know that these birds will out live me with any luck....Maybe...
But I knew going in what I was in for...Should I have said...Well I may get sick 30 years down the road...maybe I shouldn't give these guys a loving home and attention because they are going to outlive me.


As far as would I rehome them again if I find I can't properly care for them...You'd better believe it...But I would also make sure that the people these birds would be going to would be very well educated in what to expect and the needs of these birds. I can only hope that I would never allow my birds or any of my other pets to suffer because of something unforeseen happening to me and I hope that I can know when it reaches that point.

So that's why I feel its our JOB to educate, educate educate. Educate on all the aspects of owning and caring for a bird or pet regardless of what species it is. Not just glorifying it to make it more appealing. People need to know the bad aspects of these creatures too. So that Maybe we can keep these amazing birds from needing to be placed in sanctuaries.

So lets be careful with blanket statements and until you've walked a mile in someone else's shoes be careful of passing judgement to quickly.

I work closely with a rescue and a shelter. Rehoming is a big issue for me. I am pro rehoming. I wouldnt have all the lovely fids I have without such programs and people who no longer could care for their birds for a multitude of reasons.
There are alot of valid reasons for rehoming and I would prefer it and would rather people become proactive and find good homes for their pets.

I can honestly say I have seen plenty of neglect cases where rehoming should of been their priority. A meyer I talk about often is one of such sad neglect cases where she was abused so badly left in a basement for years and ignored and will never be in someones home again. She lives free in a sanctuary now but given all those years of torture she must of endured makes me shudder and wonder why once the novelty ran out that they didnt find it a good home.

My quaker was a rehome that wasnt abused. He is a really good bird actually my favorite of all the fids I have. His owner was diagnosed with a terminal illness and died and his family no longer wanted the bird. I am sure he didnt plan to get ill and get cancer and die. He had taken great care of this fid that much I can tell in the way that this quaker is so well adjusted that I think he actually trained me more than I trained him,. I feel blessed to have the opportunity to share living space with him and break bread with him every night at dinnertime.

My sun was a rehome also. Had a multitude of behavior problems because he was intended for breeding and was a caged bird the first few years of his life. He has came a long way and I enjoyed working thru all the challanges I had with him.

My lovies well they are pretty well bonded. A mismatched pair of nuts that dont like to be handled but like to play with each other and they are beautiful eye candy that I enjoy watching. Yes more rehome cases.

My U2 and given U2's are really one of the most rehomed birds there are due to the fact they can be quite high maintenence and I was able to foster her before actually making the decision. The U2's owner had to go into assisted living because she could no longer care for herself. I stepped up to the plate and devoted a forever home for her.

Forever homes...
You know we never know what life will throw us. Sometimes its one hell of a curveball. I have a will in place and have discussed with trusted people who will indeed care for my birds when I no longer walk this planet. Thats the thing about life..there are no guarantees...one day we are here...one day we are not. What we do inbetween is our call.
Lots of really bad things can happen to people and until we walk in their shoes we will never really know what its like.
All I know is that there are lots of people who do love their birds and if they do have to rehome...for whatever reason...they find good homes for their babies and that is a very responsible thing to do.

I should also add since I am writing a novel with this post is that this site in particular has given me alot of hope about responsible pet ownership and rehoming in a proactive way. I have seen it time and time again here and I see both sides...the sad side when someone has to let go of a beloved bird and the bright side where willing arms come into play to step up to the plate. Its so much better than sending a bird to the shelter. Its from one home to another.

I cant give all the birds at the shelter a spot in my house but I can devote my hands and a bit of time each week to service.

I may have taken this post wrong...but Mom, I think you have said what I wanted to, more diplomatically than I could right now. Thanks.

I guess there are a lot of aspects to this thread that I'm neither qualified nor brave enough to wade into, but I have to say these few things from my very limited experience. First, I can't imagine my little Button girl still living in the home she first lived in. To see and hear and actually be able to touch her now, you'd never know she came from a place that was hurting her every day and I'm so thankful that I had the opportunity to be her "rehome". So I will not complain about rehoming birds in need for people in need at all. As for irresponsible and uneducated people who buy a pet and then can't deal with it so they want to discard it, they should be ashamed if that's really the case. I don't know how frequently this situation occurs other places but here, you just have to walk thru a local animal shelter to see the effects of such behavior and it is sickening. Still... a rehome is better than no home or a bad home.

I don't know any mass breeders. The only breeders I know other than the ones in my own bird club are on this site and they must represent the best of the best. The breeders on this site and in my town seem to be responsible, compassionate toward their animals, and dedicated to educating potential clients in order to avoid placing their animals in unhealthy or "wrong" situations. I admire them. I'd never want to BE a breeder because I don't have the time, patience, or resources to do it, but I'm grateful for them because they are ultimately resonsible for me having Cooper and Buttons and my finches.
Gosh... that's more than I wanted to say I guess. In a nutshell, I don't think this thread was meant to offend or insult anyone, but generalizing about breeders and rehoming just shouldn't be done.

I also have to say I disagree. Yes, there are bad breeders out there, but many breeders breed for the love of it and are responsible about where their birds go. The breeders I have issues with are the ones that mass breed to supply chain stores and what not, but that's a whole other story. Mainly..be responsible for what you bring into this world, and you'll have my utmost respect.

As far as rehoming goes, no one knows what life for someone else is like. Take when I rehomed Casey to Andie for example. I had every intention of keeping Casey forever. I loved that bird almost as much as I love my child. We came to a point, however, where it was perfectly obvious that Casey was unhappy here. Throwing himself against the cage bars screaming constantly no matter what we did. He hated my husband and my daughter with a complete and total passion, and the frustration in that he couldn't chase them from the home was obvious. I made the decision to rehome him to Andie, and I think she'll attest to the fact that Casey was so much happier there.

In my opinion, if someone can't care for the animal properly anymore, they need to recognize that and find them better placement. Even if it's someone who just doesn't want the animal anymore, rehome them. I would MUCH rather see an animal be rehomed responsibly then sit in a home where they aren't wanted and possibly aren't receiving the care and attention they deserve. I'm not advocating rehoming a pet and then getting another one just cause, but we have to face the facts. Sometimes the animals just don't mesh with the family and rehoming is the best option for everyone involved. Having worked in dog and cat rescue, I've seen animals that should have been rehomed long ago but their owners refused to because they couldn't bear the thought of parting with their beloved baby, or because they felt it would be to hard an adjustment for the animal, or for whatever reason. Usually, by the time it got to the point that rescue got involved, the animal is in such poor condition it's heartbreaking. The ones that get me are the people that know they're moving or what have you and never bother trying to find a home until the last minute, or something to that effect. Anyhow, there are all kinds of reasons for rehoming a pet, and we can't judge unless we've walked in their shoes. As long as it's done responsibly with the animals welfare first and foremost, I have no problems with it.

As a blanket statement I completely disagree ...

There are many breeders who take in rescues from uneducated owners and rehabilitate them so they can be rehomed. Mostly because of their love for birds and also because of the experience they possess.
There are also situations in which birds that have been purchased as breeders just can't be in a breeding program and it wouldn't be fair to keep that bird in that situation so a responsible breeder would find a forever home for that bird ...
Then there are the situations where life throws you a curve ball .. not intended but it happens.

Should responsible breeders stop breeding? NO WAY!

Why? Just ask anyone who has a wild caught bird ... Lets face it .. parrot keeping is something people will continue to want to do. We have proven that just by being members here .. we all have parrots! Regardless of how we became parrot keepers it is a known fact that there is a market for our feathered friends as companions.

There will always be a market so why not have that market satisfied by a responsible breeder versus mass breeding? Why not have parrots bred responsibly in captivity and leave the wild birds alone? It has only been in the last few months that The World Parrot Trust was instrumental in convincing Eu to ban the imports of wild caughts ... That is a great step in the right direction.

The next major hurdle is get a handle on mass breeding ..

I do however believe that breeders should be certified. I think certification should consist of courses relating to husbandry techniques, involvement in the avian community, birds should be banded and the aviaries should be veterinary certified. I think this will go a long way in trying to eliminate mass breeding.

We expect our birds to be cared for by avian vets. We won't accept a vet that has been in school for 7 years unless they take time to be avian certified .. why should we expect any less from the breeders.

Many breeders do the above on their own and aren't required to do so by law .. I however did my homework and purchased my quaker from a breeder who does all of the above and wouldn't have purchased from one who didn't!

I just re-read this and am curious if I'm understanding this statement correctly....And please correct me if I'm not understanding it.

How can the CAG be there to take care of the owner until someone arrives? I don't understand this part.

I understand the CAG being lonely and depressed from having been rehomed But are you doing the bird a favor by reuniting him with the original owner if that owner is truly sick and can't care for the bird properly?


I'm not trying to attack I'm just trying to understand the statement...

Thanks

I wondered that as well Connie.

Just wanted to add that in some cases that it is in the best interest of a bird to rehome!

We rescued our CAG when he was 22 years old. Based on his prior situation rehoming him was the best thing for him ... now a year later he is a completely different fellow ... and I don't doubt that these years will be the best of his life....

I have to say that this thread is going to either dissapear or become a very "heated" thread. I do not want to voice my opinion one way or the other. I kind of left some kind of a semi-reply.....ha ha, getting off scott free here
But we have to remember here that absolutely NONE of us on this FORUM are EXPERTS, not ONE of US. We only know what we know from experience, but that does NOT make us EXPERTS. Ok, I have said my peace...

Was there even a reason to post this? Beside's to address someone with out saying a name? Really - we are human. We can not judge one another. Just as those should not judge you for your thoughts. BUT - I see NO reason to say those things unless your trying to hurt someone. To the someone she is trying to hurt HUGE HUGS! You are doing what you feel is right, thats what I support!!!!

ok, we need to address the post and not the poster......enough said.....

There's no reason that this thread needs to become heated. I have gone back through and read the original post numerous times and each and every reply to it a couple times as well.


I'm trying to look at the original post from lots of different prospectives. And I'd like to address this in another manner. And whether the original post was meant as a dig at someone or not I have no idea...but if it were to have been, This is my reply to that.

I know many many breeders...Most of these people have numerous "PET" birds as well as breeders. Several of the Breeders I know personally have had life altering things happen either loss of job, or loss of health etc. When things like that happen its time to down size drastically or get out completely. Some of these breeders have chosen to rehome their pet birds before selling off or rehoming breeders for several reasons.

It isn't because they are out for the money end of it...heavens... 3 breeders of the many that I know that have had to reduce their flocks re-homed some of their pet birds first because they knew they would be the easiest to re-home. Keeping the more problematic ones that might end up being passed from home to home to home! Its not because these personal pets weren't loved...but it was because it was easier to find good homes for them.

Some of these breeders decided that by doing that maybe with fewer mouths to feed they'd be able to keep a few more of the problem birds and rehabilitate further or wait till another breeder came along that knew what they wanted and who knew what they were doing so again these birds that had only ever been used as breeder wouldn't end up in a home where someone would think they could be turned into a pet...It just doesn't work that way...Sometimes there are rare instances when it does...but most of the time...Breeders are breeders for life.

If you have breeder birds...are you supposed to just keep feeding these birds and not let them at least pay for themselves as far as food goes. I can tell you first hand that it isn't cheap to keep breeders that aren't producing.

So the scenerio changes somewhat...now the person is faced with either keeping all their pet birds... and trying to sell off all or most of the breeder birds to anyone that wants to spend the money regardless of whether they have the experience etc. And still be financially strapped because you aren't able to find suitable homes for all the birds...Or do you rehome the ones that you know would be good pets...

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out...at least not in my book anyway...My opinion is you re-home the easiest first...and then go from there till you get to a manageable proportion again.

It's never easy for ANYONE who truly loves birds to re-home or sell any of their birds especially if they were pets. But you do what you have to do in this world to get by...and as many of us have already said in this thread...until you've walked a mile in someone elses shoes don't pass judgement on them.

This is a terrific thread. I don't feel I have much to add because I think everone has contributed to this debate.

I will only say this. There are some people that are "Hoarders" in that they get so caught up with the experience of having so many birds around them without thinking about the time, and more importantly the cost that is involved in keeping these birds healthy both psycholgically and physicaly. While people cannot always predict when or if financial hardship will come our way, people do have a duty to not overwhelm themselves with birds that they can not properly care for, in the same way that people should not purchase item that they cannot afford to buy.

The link below is a page from a local bird rescue that puts things in perspective quite well. I suggest people take a look at it.

http://www.birdloversonly.org/blinfo.shtml

I was debating whether to reply to this or not. I'm a strong advocate for rescue/spay/neuter....



Having said this. I agree with everyone else here about rehoming a pet bird, or pet in general for the various reasons already stated in previous posts.



However, I think were the original post was coming from and points actually meant with it, was not the actual deed of rehoming if that needed to be done, but rather the simple fact that a lot of people just get a pet because they think it would be nice, the kids would like, have some type of unrealistic expectations.......whatever the reason, it wasn't thought out and carefully planned. Hence, the pet ends up rehomed or at a shelter. (and I'm not talking about things that happen in life and we can't change....) Further I think also that this post reflects on the overpopulation of pet birds. Yes there is one and I also know that this does not include all species. This is not intended for the small dedicated breeder with the love and care and a purpose to better or preserve a breed. This is to the mass breeding mills and even the hobby breeder that thinks it would be cute to breed some birds, great experience for the kids etc. make some $$....again all for the wrong reasons in lieu of all the homeless birds and pets in general already out there. http://www.avianwelfare.org/issues/marketing.htm



That's the way at least I think this original post was refferring to.

I think Mr.Marc Johnson can explain it much better than I can.
"I’m not against people keeping parrots," Johnson stresses. "I’m looking for homes all the time. But the rate we are adopting birds out is much slower than the rate we’re http://www.parrotchronicles.com/fall2001/r...light.htmtaking them in."