Hi all ..

I know I'm probably going to take a little heat for this, but if you remember I posted about getting two Suns a few weeks ago. I had planned on keeping them together, at least initially, but after reading all the comments about it not being a good idea, I got another cage so each Sun had there own.

5 days ago, I took them both in for their first vet visit. I got a bit of a surprise. The vet .. who is an avian specialist, said there was no way the Suns were only 4 mos. old, he guessed them to be at least a year.

I was wondering why I had been struggling so much with them. They were both very cage aggressive, even after being separated. My hands look like war zones from trying to handle them over the past weeks. While they were a lot of fun to watch, and great eaters .. they just didn't want to be handled. In the back of my head, I thought it was unusual that two hand fed babies would be so aggressive. Well, they might have been hand fed, but they weren't truly babies.

After the vet visit I was so torn. I was attached to them, but also felt like I had been duped. I felt that if I had wanted birds that needed work, then that would be find, but I wanted a hand fed baby who was reasonably sweet and that I could handle without needing bandaids at the ready.

So, I made the hard decision and contact the breeder with my concerns. I think he knew he was wrong, because he didn't really put up much a fuss about my concerns. Although he wouldn't admit to lying about their age, he offered another baby from a future clutch, stating that perhaps me and the birds weren't bonding well .. that perhaps a different bird might. I really didn't want another bird from him at this point. I told him I would keep them, but felt that an adjustment to their price should be made. He wouldn't do that. All he would offer is another baby.

So, I have a "credit" with him, that I doubt I'll ever use, and no Suns. I did return them to him. I know many here might think I should have kept them, and worked with them, but that's not what I wanted. I wanted and paid for, a hand fed baby that was well socialized.

Anyway, so now I'm back to just me and Ivy for now. I feel horrible about returning the Suns, but felt it was the right thing for me.

So, I invested in two birds, two new cages and tons of new toys .. I feel like .. I can't even describe .. like an idiot ... like I gave up .. I don't know. I don't even know if I really did the right thing. If he had offered to even refund part the money, I think I would have keep them and just made the commitment to work really hard with them. It's really not about the money, more like the principle.

Now he's got my money, and both Suns, which I'm sure he'll re-sell .. guess I'm the dummy and he's the smart one .. huh?

I just didn't want birds who's main goal in life seemed to be ripping the skin from my hands and fingers.

Well, that's my story .. feel free to tell me what an idiot I am .. I deserve it.

I do hope you got something in writing and his signature stating that he owes you this bird. If not that is the only thing that you might want to rectify, Dont let him dupe ya twice. Anyway as for the other I think you did right. They may or may not have improved to be the babies you wanted. It is your business.

I think you did the right thing. Consider how long you would have lived with these birds that may have never made you truly happy. Although, I would consider taking the baby from him. Just at least go see them when the time comes. You may have a change of heart, and you won't have lost your hard earned cash And as Majj said. Get it in writing that he owes you

Nancy

You are the only one that can make the decision on if you did the right thing or not. I definitely would get something in writing, NOW, stating that you have a credit with him and in what amount. You may think you don't want anything from him TODAY, but you might down the road, after all there is this thing called MBS that is very contagious on this forum. All kidding aside, please get something in writing soon.....

Believe me I know exactly how you feel xcali, as I too have returned birds in the past...not because I was misled but because for whatever reason, I just did not bond with them. Well, that's not totally true, there was one Senegal named Romeo who I really did love, but at the time we were in an apt. and he was a very needy bird and wanted to be with me all the time, and he had a seriously high pitched scream that he would do everytime I tried to put him on a playstand or cage. My qp didn't take anytime at all to pick up the same scream (and does it to this day) and my hubby just could not take the noise level. Luckily, we got him from this awesome pet shop here in Dallas, where the owner was more than happy to take him (and a meyers, and another female senegal) back and give us store credit. I'm pretty sure that our biggest problem was that we really really wanted a caique, but just could not afford the price tag, and we were disappointed with all the others. I felt so GUILTY each and every time we returned one, and when we took Romeo back, I was in tears. One of the ladies at that shop still to this day won't speak to me when we go in, but thank goodness the owner is a really sweet girl who hugged me and said that she felt like everything was for a reason, and not to feel badly, because all she really wanted was for all of her birds to be with the person who takes them home for a lifetime, and for the people and the birds to be happy. In the end, she had an abundance of caiques who were getting older (not old, but they were 6 mos old when i got mine), and she saw how much we loved this one in particular, so she pulled me aside after we had visited him for about the 100th time, and said that she had decided to let us have him for the same price that we paid for the other birds. We LOVE him to death, and he is now one of the family. We take him back to visit every week or so, and Debbie (the owner) always hugs us and tells us how happy she is that we finally found the perfect new member to our flock.

Bottom line is that a bird lives a long time, and if it's "parront" isn't happy with him/her, then he won't be happy either. The 3 parrots that I returned all got a new forever home within 2 days of going back to the pet shop, and the meyers actually went home with someone WHILE I was there returning her. In addition to that, we took each one to the vet, and had all the initial bloodwork done to the tune of about 200.00 each, and we took the records back to the pet shop with us, so the new "parronts' actually got quite a good deal with their new babies all having their first vet visit documented and done with.

I support your decision 100%, but as the others said, I'd be sure to get something in writing from the breeder, because you could just change your mind when he has a new clutch of little babies!!

birds are not an easy pet they are a LONG time commitment and if you dont click w. them then you and they will be miserable long long time so to me you did the right thing for you and the birds!

Yes, I did get it writing .. we both signed it and it's dated. Stating he owed me first choice of two Sun Conures from a future clutch. Should I end up using the credit, I'll be sure to visit these birds from early on, just to be sure they are what they are presented to be. We'll see what happens in the future, right now, I'm just really sad about the whole thing.

Look forward to 2 babies! Suns are very smart and as babies are will be playful.
Go to You tube abd look up Sun conures playing and watch some vids also leo the Sun conure. Leo is a really sweet Sun conure on there that was raised from a baby and they can do anything with him and he plays and plays! You wont regret your waiting!

Totally understandable about being sad. But I think you did the right thing... I'd keep after him for the babis too. Did he tell you when he was expecting to have more babies. I'd start calling him a month or so before he said and ask him to let you come pick the babies you want and mark them with a marker so that you're sure you get the ones you wnat. Then go back once a week or so and check on them and handle them.
The more their handled the better it will be. There's a big difference between being hand fed and hand fed and socialized!!

Also make sure that as soon as they're weaned you get them into separate cages so they'll pay more attention to you than to each other.

Good Luck, Hange in there....at least you'll be all ready for them this next time...including the toys and cages. Toys never go to waste!

I have to tell you...I think your vet may have been wrong. By looking at their coloring from the photos you posted a while back....I would say they were actually about four months. My sun conure started changing colors around 5 months and she was a late bloomer. Yours looked to be right on track. Actually...my sun is 11 months old and is just about fully changed into her adult colors...if yours were a year old they would have been much more bright yellow then they were. I am not judging you on your decision but..they were definatly about 4 months

you did the right thing in this situation. It wasn't right of him to do that to you. You did what was right for you and personally I'd have done the same thing. It was a bonded pair and the truth is they may never have bonded to you at that point. I'm sorry for your loss but I think you will be happy in the end if you do decide to get the 2 babies.

Yes suns wings are green as babies and change coulour gradually over the first 8months so you probably did have babies ..But if you wern`t bonding and they were agressive I would say they were not handled much and had bonded to each other for company ..they need to be handled daily to remain tame and friendly....

Thanks everyone for all the support .. I've been feeling horribly guilty about returning them.

Nikki .. you're not the first person to have said that. I even contacted the vet after the initial exam and asked him about the "young" coloring. The vet said that even if he was incorrect on judging their age, he felt that they were overly aggressive considering they were supposed to be hand fed, 4 mo. old conures.

This is why I'm so worried about getting other birds from this breeder. My gut tells me something was represented honestly .. whether it was their age, hand feeding .. or something else.

He told me in all likelyhood, there would be babies available in Feb. His Suns are on eggs again. So.. figure .. hatch time .. hand feeding time .. etc.. I guess.

I'll make a decision when the time comes, until then, again, thanks all for making me feel a little less crappy about returning the Suns.

I reread what I wrote and it sounded rude...I apologize...but I didn't want it to not go unsaid because they did seem like babies to me and I didn't want the breeder to get a bad wrap for that....but the fact that they were hand fed he should get a bad wrap. My sun was not hand fed and was not handled before I got her and I know that for a fact..and she was VERY VERY aggressive when I got her...My hubby and I both have scars to prove it. She did come around though and is fine but does have her issues. If he will not give you your money back then I don't want you to go away empty handed because you are afraid of the aggression. My sun is one of the 3 loves of my life (my quaker and hubby being the other 2) and I promise you will be okay in the end. Defiantly 2 is probably not a good idea and if you do get another..ask if you can be a part of the hand feeding process of your new one and see if he will let you come once a week or so to help feed and tell him its so you can "bond" that way you wont have to accuse him of not hand feeding and you can check up on the process. Good luck!

I also think you did the right thing. I do think they were babies because of the coloring, but "HAND FED" and "HAND FED AND HANDLED DAILY" are 2 different things.
By all means take his offer of babies or even one baby and lots of toys and food, but make sure they are handled DAILY.

The other birds may have been hand fed, but that alone isn't good enough if you want a sweet, loving baby! Best wishes!!!